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In this Discussion
Animation types
Hello,
I've been talking to different mobile game developer's (most of them use unity3d), and one interesting topic was the animations.
Basically almost none of them use frame animations (well they do in some way, but not in the way I'm used to).
Most described downsides of frame based animations is that it takes a lot of space and animations itself are not as smooth, as most of them wants.
So the key solution by their description is to use keyframe animations, where you provide basic images and let the engine do the tweening/interpolation to achieve smooth animation effects.
One of the tools they described using was the Spriter:
http://www.brashmonkey.com/spriter.htm
which then exports XML that can be interpreted and would generate the animation.
Here's explanation and tutorial on implementing interpretation of that xml:
http://www.brashmonkeygames.com/spriter/8-17-2012/GettingStartedWithSCMLGuide(a2).pdf
So guys what do you think? Is it better to use frame based animations or keyframe animations?
Is something like this needed for Gideros? or maybe already available, something that interprets Spriter?
Or maybe we could ask the Good Guy @GregBUG (reference intended
) to think about supporting it in TNT Animator Studio? 
Basically what are your thoughts?
I've been talking to different mobile game developer's (most of them use unity3d), and one interesting topic was the animations.
Basically almost none of them use frame animations (well they do in some way, but not in the way I'm used to).
Most described downsides of frame based animations is that it takes a lot of space and animations itself are not as smooth, as most of them wants.
So the key solution by their description is to use keyframe animations, where you provide basic images and let the engine do the tweening/interpolation to achieve smooth animation effects.
One of the tools they described using was the Spriter:
http://www.brashmonkey.com/spriter.htm
which then exports XML that can be interpreted and would generate the animation.
Here's explanation and tutorial on implementing interpretation of that xml:
http://www.brashmonkeygames.com/spriter/8-17-2012/GettingStartedWithSCMLGuide(a2).pdf
So guys what do you think? Is it better to use frame based animations or keyframe animations?
Is something like this needed for Gideros? or maybe already available, something that interprets Spriter?
Or maybe we could ask the Good Guy @GregBUG (reference intended
) to think about supporting it in TNT Animator Studio? Basically what are your thoughts?
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Comments
I'm a professional animator. I can say that it all depends on the style you want to achieve and like motion capture it has its uses. The problem with that kind of animation is that it can easily look disjointed or like a marionette, even though the movement is smooth.
The only project I've seen working really well is Rayman Origins with their UbiArt framework. What they do is combine that kind of movement with a lot of sprites (animated one). Everything that just needs to be moved, rotated or scaled is done that way, but as soon as you need a particular shape change (eyes popping out of the face), then a new drawing is necessary
Have a look at these videos to see what I mean:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=B_QhZYTukac
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=L4ABO8wsexY
This is something I would really love to see, but I think it would require a really good editor.
.Gian
Likes: atilim, phongtt
http://www.coronalabs.com/blog/2012/10/09/dynamically-optimized-sprite-sheets/
Likes: atilim, phongtt
@hnim yes this article basically proves my point.
@gianmichele UbiArt seems great. I think it's not available to the public?
Another great game that used this tweening method is a JRPG called Odin Sphere by Vanillaware. The story is amazing IMO
We will see if Spriter is good enough for this task later this year.
http://www.nightspade.com
I have spent so much time working on each frames of the animations for my character (around 50, still more to do and other characters are planned for future updates), I am very interested in using keyframe animations.
As @gianmichele said : Yes, to bring the best from both worlds drawing a lot would still be required.
But I am very interested in any solution to smooth my animations and make it easy to reuse and update a lot of my assets.
I would LOVE to work on something like Muramasa The Demon Blade (Vanillaware strikes again).
So another task to "someday todo" list
Will Spriter support Gideros?
I believe the following comment is interesting (seen on the Kickstarter comments page) : Also, I was pretty sure that the author of Spriter (Edgar Muniz) had left a post here a few month ago to introduce his product but couldn't find it... until I found this message by @avo : Ok, his discussion was lost. So the author of Spriter knows about Gideros, came here to promote his product, and seems to keep in mind to make his product support Gideros.But Gideros is not listed on the product page.?
I believe I'll just have to be (very) patient and see.
Until the product is out and the support implemented, since @ndoss's implementation (thank you for the work done and shared
TNTAnimator Studio [ download link ] by @gregBUG is an amazing tool and already fills almost all my needs.
But if we could have it and Spriter to work on our animations, that would be wonderful.
my only doubt is performance... with "lua" implementation...
mmm...
downloading spriter a3... and see...
www.tntengine.com
http://indiedevstories.com/2012/07/18/exporting-flash-animations-to-cocos2d-actions/
Likes: phongtt
I have no experience with Flash, does it support bitmaps as well as vector based illustrations?
(I mean "yes" it supports bitmaps but how well?)
@gorkem
I started a draft mail right after leaving my comment here, will finish after I'm done with today's work
That's what I always do : contact third party developers and tell them about why they should consider adding support for Gideros in their products.
Likes: gorkem
http://www.tntparticlesengine.com/?cat=14
I spent five minutes with ... and I get it.
oups, previously I posted in the wrong discussion
I have never used Flash but I'll probably subscribe soon.
When I asked "how well..." that's because I have seen a lot of people using Flash with vector based sprites, but I don't know much about bitmaps.
If Flash handles all of that well, where does Spriter shine?
Is that because you can handle animation templates better?
Of course, you can use bitmap to make animation in Flash.
Not only Flash, many other animation software can help you make animation in your game till Spriter released (maybe, when it's released you dont need to use
I like Flash because it's lightweight, 2D, easy to use (from noob like me
Spriter is still can be shine, because:
- that's major work
- many new features relate to game can be added in future
- one click to export data (no script needed)
- cheaper price with free option.
- you dont need to write your parser. You can request or porting from other engine.
Likes: Mells
Likes: Mells
http://www.nightspade.com
And yes i agree that we could use flash just for the animation data, with a parser we can make it works. I think Plant vs Zombie use similar tech to allow dev use flash animation.
However just like you said, with spriter being a more specialized tool for game animation tooling, i hope it could give a good workflow predefined.
http://www.nightspade.com
Thank you, that was very helpful and gave me some informations for the future.
I'll probably subscribe to Adobe Cloud services soon.
Taking this way, if Spriteloq could support Gideros... mmm
Likes: gorkem